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CoachJo

new Enhanced Options Editor

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CoachJo

You have got to be kidding me!

 

You want us to pay $10 to be able to do what has been included in virtually every program for more than 20 years?  I couldn't believe it when I found out I'd have to code to make some green text.  Or if I wanted to make a bold word or italicize a phrase.  

 

In your front-page promotion you say it is so easy to "edit some options or change some text," that DMS is an amazing system for managing your design."  No disclaimer about that that doesn't include basic text options that have been around in virtually every document software program since the 80s.  As you point out, this is standard in WordPress.  It even comes with the text box I'm typing in now!

 

In your Walk-Through video you brag about your "robust typography system."  Robust?

 

You say it "lets you change colors of your website and links and text with just a few clicks."  Really?  You should have said "eventually" and "for more money."

 

I suppose next week you'll come out with something else to purchase so I can finally get rid of the white space at the bottom of my text boxes.  Or whatever else people are having the most problems with. 

 

Bad business model.

 

 

 

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Jackey

:: nods :: But you can hardly blame the maker to provide functionality, that (I think) should have been in the core product in the first place.

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Danny

Hi Jo,

 

You can choose Text color, as well as Link color? You can also change the font weight in the Typography settings ?

 

You can also change your text color, weight etc.. using the Wordpress WYSIWYG.

 

If you want more control by selecting individual colors for specific sections such as Masthead or Hero, then you need to understand that we don't want DMS to become bloated and overwhelm its users with options and color pickers.

 

For example, about 3 years ago, PageLines released Platform Pro, which had something like 30 plus options just for colors, the majority of feedback received from Platform Pro users was that these options were just far too confusing. So when designing PageLines Framework we took this feedback on board and removed these options to simplify the workflow and replace the 30 plus color options with something called Color Math. Which used different tones and contrasts based on your base color choice.

 

For example, If you selected White as your base color, then your navigation states such as hover and active, would be different tones of grey. This was amazing as you could basically have unlimited choice of color schemes for your website simply by selecting one color. Unfortunately, the feedback from this was mixed, most users liked it, but there were quite a few who preferred the Platform Pro color options, as it gave you more control.

 

Now when developing DMS, we didn't want to include 30+ options, because this will make DMS bloated and as I mentioned above, those options only confused users in Platform Pro. So we have now added a special Styling Classes field, which allow you to add your own unique classes to sections.

An example of this would be to create the following classes.

 

.text-green { color: green !important; }

 

The in the Styling Classes field add the class name like so: text-green

 

Click save and where ever you added this class to, the text should be green. The styling classes field is a very powerful option.


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CoachJo

When I hit 'Reply to this topic,' a style box pops up that offers pretty standard stuff.  That's what I want to happen when I edit a text box on my website in DMS.  It's common in most programs and certainly no more than I expected.

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Rob

Jo, I've mentioned this issue to our management, and I don't know why it wasn't included, though I'm sure there's a reason.  DMS is brand new, and evolving. I'm confident things will improve in time and the requests people, such as yourself, make, and good recommendations will be seriously considered. If its possible, we do try to include those we can, in updates.  I can't promise anything, except that it will be looked at by our developers.


Former PageLines Moderator, Food Expert and Raconteur

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thebastion

Ha ha! They beat me to it.

 

It would appear that a lot of people would pay for that functionality, well done. The only time I have ever used a WYSWYG editor is for posts in Wordpress.

 

CoachJo which other Wordpress frameworks or webdesign apps have a WYSWYG that allows you to edit things on the front end design and not just posts? I have never seen that yet in any of the other frameworks I have used.

 

For anybody interested then here is the link to what is being talked about (I think):

http://www.pagelines.com/shop/plugins/enhanced-options-editor/

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CoachJo

If I had any idea that that functionality wouldn't be available in DMS based on what they promised in their promotional materials, believe me, I would never have bought it.  To me, it's the most basic requirement of a front-end, drag & drop, user-friendly, easy program.

 

Especially since the last one I used had that.... WildApricot.com and then of course there's the free Front-end Editor plugin in WordPress but I don't think that would work with DMS.

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Rob

CoachJo,  Much has been said about what our promotional materials say.  When I read comments about it I find one common thread. Everyone hears or reads what they want to hear or read, no matter what we say.  And honestly, if I showed two people the same exact video, they'd each come away with their own interpretation or opinion of it.

 

If DMS isn't working well for you, we'll help you, as much as possible to make it work.  But please remember, those videos and pages speak about using DMS out of the box.  As soon as someone gets it, the first thing they try to do is add unique customizations, which changes everything.  So, I'm politely asking, if you have a particularly problem, ask us and we'll be happy to help.

 

I should add that thebastion is not a member of our team, but like you, a customer and a very nice guy who's trying to help his fellow customers, knowing how swamped we are. I'll have to go over this thread this weekend to make sure I help you more.  Please accept my apologies for any delays or misunderstandings.  It's not easy answering 140 to 150 people in 5 hours.  Especially when some write novels because they can't find a button or min-height setting.


Former PageLines Moderator, Food Expert and Raconteur

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CoachJo

Rob, Don't get me wrong, I've been able to build a very nice site with DMS.  It's taken me way longer than I thought it would and been harder because the documentation seems to assume that users have basic developer skills, which I don't.  Maybe you should have some non-developers on your team so you can incorporate how they think into your documentation.  It seems documentation for us is steps B-C-D  instead of the A-B-C-D-E that we need.

 

Really, if the text box had the toolbar that this reply box had, it would be a lot easier.  For example, I'd like to refer to my newsletter and other publications by putting them in italics with a highlight and select, not by writing code.  One ongoing frustration that I've asked about several times and studied everything about it the documentation and in the forum is reducing the amount of space at the bottom of the text boxes and media boxes.

 

I can't get some plugins to work with DMS but expect it could be done if only I knew how.  A well-written explanation of this in the documentation would be appreciated.  For example, I've sent invitations by snail mail that allow recipients to sign in with a username and password I supplied that will give them access to a special offer.  I've been trying to use the Protected Content plugin to do this but it doesn't work, nor has any other alternative I've tried.  Needless to say, this is something I really need to solve.  I've also tried to get the Affiliates plugin to work and have got half way there but it was really hard to do so and I expect there's a better way than I came up with.  (I'm working with the plugin authors to fix some aspects of it and know that there are issues outside of DMS.)

 

Like thebastion, I too have tried to help out by answering others' questions when I felt I could.  And I understand the frustration you must feel when it's obvious that someone has posted a new topic in the forum without first looking for previous answers and reading the documentation.  

 

Sorry, it looks like I've written a novel here...

 

Thanks for all you do.

 

Joanne

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Rob

Joanne,

 

When we decided to organize our docs team, two key people were chosen.  Danny to write them, and me, to edit and make sure they were written for the average Joe or Joanne.  Neither Danny nor I are developers or programmers.  We decided, together, to write the docs in a very 'matter-of-fact' manner, providing as much information as we had at the time, keeping in mind DMS was being built as we were writing.  As I edited, I kept in mind, always, that the people reading the docs were not going to be developers and needed straightforward information.

 

I understand your desires for text editing in the Textarea, and it would be a nice little addition, but that's not what the text area is for and if we added those tools, I can assure you, the section would be messed up.  Its purpose is an all-purpose content container, like the old Content Box in Framework.  People use it to add shortcodes, often, and if someone applied styling to the shortcode,  like bolding or underlining, it would break the shortcode. Then instead of you and a few others concerned with the lack of those tools, we'd have thousands complaining they have no safe way of adding shortcodes.  So it's a darned-if-you-do, and darned-if-you-don't situation.  Our developers, I believe, decided correctly to support the need for a container for all types of text.

 

Most people who want to format text, adding things like bold, h tags, underlining, strikethrough, etc. know how to do it with the manual code, but also know they can use a WordPress page in text mode, and copy the code over to the Textarea, fast and easy.  Is that cumbersome and inconvenient? Without a doubt.  But safer than the alternative.

 

Now to address the plugins issue.  DMS uses lots of newer technology. The latest versions of javascript, jQuery, ajax, etc.  So when plugins use these things too, but don't use the latest versions, there's likely going to be a conflict.  There are several options.  First, to ask the developer to download DMS (free) and try and adapt his code to meet ours (we can't reverse engineer to meet the coding of 29,000+ plugins). Most of them are eager to comply and willing to have their products useful to our tens of thousands of customers. The cons of this are you have to wait for them to get around to it. Next, you can replace the plugin with one that you test and find works in DMS.  This, of course is also time consuming.

 

Lastly, you can look on premium plugin website like our Store or CodeCanyon for an alternative.  Paid product developers are usually more responsive and responsible, and helpful, I might add, to their clients.

 

Your help with other clients is deeply appreciated, as is thebastion"]'s and @[member="batman's and others.  My frustrations here, I promise, come more from people who use the forums to express their keyboard warrior skills.

 

As for writing a novel, you can tell, I'm turning into a Tolstoy doing this job. :D


Former PageLines Moderator, Food Expert and Raconteur

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CoachJo

Rob,

 

"...use a WordPress page in text mode, and copy the code over to the Textarea, fast and easy."  I didn't know!  This is great!  Where is that in the documentation?  I missed it.

 

Thanks,

Joanne :thumbsu:  

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Danny

Hi Jo,

 

The TextBox, MediaBox etc.. are simply boxes that support HTML, Shortcodes adding a WYSIWYG to them in core in my opinion would be a bad move, as most people hate and I mean really hate WYSIWYGs. The first thing I do when I install Wordpress is completely disable the Wordpress Visual Editor.

 

To change your text to bold, italic, change it color etc.. is quite simple with HTML. I understand what you're saying in regards to this makes some peoples lives easier, but the majority of them hate them. One of our store developers has released a WYSIWYG plugin that provides this functionality.

 

http://www.pagelines.com/shop/plugins/enhanced-options-editor/

 

This is the purpose of the PageLines store, for developers to create products that add, improve on the core functionality of PageLines DMS. You can see examples of this all over the web, for example Apple, some people think that the iPad/iPhone is missing some pretty basic phone functionality, but you can find an App that offers it. Thats the whole point. We don't want to over bloat DMS, being bloated only causes confusion.

 

Our typography page shows basic html that allows you to make your text bold, italic, etc.. - http://docs.pagelines.com/tutorials/typography

If you give it a chance, you will find that using HTML, instead of a WYSIWYG is better.

 

If you want to protect your content, I've found S2Member to provide good functionality, there are number of similar products, which I haven't tested.

http://www.s2member.com/framework/

 

If you have any other issues with things you feel should be documented, please email me at danny at pagelines dot com


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